E28: Bye Week Questions with Morgan Cannon from Pride of Detroit

In this episode of 'Talking Grit,' hosts Jason Harwood and Jacob Litton conduct a quarterly review of the Detroit Lions' season. They are joined by Morgan Cannon from Pride of Detroit to discuss the Lions' recent performances, cherished memories of Barry Sanders, and nostalgic highlights from past Lions games. The conversation covers the Lions' current 3-1 standing, with discussions on key players like Aiden Hutchinson and David Montgomery. The hosts also reflect on the team's past struggles and how current developments indicate a departure from the 'same old Lions' narrative. An analysis of upcoming games and strategies for improvement is shared, along with speculation on whether the Vikings are genuine contenders this season.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Intro
• 4:02 Barry Sanders Era Memories
• 7:38 Current Lions Season Analysis
• 18:38 Favorite Plays of the Season
• 22:33 Offensive MVP Discussion
• 29:17 Defensive MVP Discussion
• 34:55 Cornerback Penalties and Performance
• 39:41 Overcoming the Same Old Lions Mentality
• 49:23 NFC North Contenders: Vikings and Packers
• 53:50 Bears' Struggles and Future Prospects
• 55:23 Outro

Transcript

Jason Harwood: 0:40

Welcome to another episode of talking grit. I'm Jason Harwood. And with me is Jacob Litton an upcoming game. We thought we'd do a quarterly review here, just like an accountant. We're just going to the checks here. Uh, we're going to be a bean counter, right? Jacob.

Jacob: 0:54

I knew it was coming. I knew you were going to say it.

Jason Harwood: 0:58

We've decided to invite a guest,

Jacob: 1:00

Time out, time out. Morgan, do you know what a bean counter is? Have you heard that before ever in your life?

Morgan Cannon: 1:05

And is that another term for an accountant?

Jason Harwood: 1:08

Yeah,

Jacob: 1:08

He kind of led you into that, but yes. But you've never heard that before, right? Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 1:14

Maybe like in a book or something. I read a lot. So maybe in like a, one of my

Jacob: 1:17

He's just trying to make you not feel bad.

Jason Harwood: 1:20

know.

Jacob: 1:20

That's off the wall.

Jason Harwood: 1:22

Yeah. It's my name

Jacob: 1:24

continue. Yeah,

Jason Harwood: 1:25

football team for a reason being counter'cause of that. All right. right. We've decided to invite a guest. Some of you maybe familiar with it's Morgan Cannon from the pride of Detroit. I personally am a huge fan of his work. He's been helping me with learning, um, how to do film. And he's, uh, been a mentor for me for that. So I really appreciate him coming on. So you, Morgan, for showing up. And I think Jacob's got a question to start this off on.

Jacob: 1:53

with uh, you know, most of the guests that we have on, we like to ask a question just to kind of see how long you've been a fan, uh, you know. So, what we're going to ask you is who, who was your first Detroit Lions jersey that you ever had?

Morgan Cannon: 2:06

Oh, I'm easy for me. Uh, appreciate y'all having me. Of course. Uh, excited to be on, uh, mine's Barry. I'm an, I was born

Jacob: 2:13

Yeah,

Morgan Cannon: 2:14

I was born in 1990. Um, was born into this and everything, uh, like dad being from Flint and everything. So, uh, yeah, Barry. Uh, but I've had shoot all kinds of them through the years. You know what I mean? I like, just like all of us, but yeah, probably a

Jacob: 2:29

right.

Morgan Cannon: 2:30

Kind of chalky, right?

Jacob: 2:32

That's like the classic one

Jason Harwood: 2:33

mean,

Jacob: 2:34

hang on, who is the quarterback of the team? I know bear was your first Jersey, but if you think about when you first started watching every week, when you were really into it, when you were all about it, who was the quarterback that was playing?

Morgan Cannon: 2:46

Shoot, man. I remember them all because I got a weird brain like Eric Kramer, Rodney Pete, Scott Mitchell, you know, so like through that whole, like just kind of rolling through the nineties there. So yeah, Scott Mitchell, probably like when I really became like a little more. Aware of what was going on. You know what I mean? Like I started playing at six, seven years old and you start to pick up, you're like, Oh, okay. Like, this is why this is happening. It just becomes a little more technical, you know?

Jacob: 3:12

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 3:14

So yeah, good old Scott Mitchell.

Jason Harwood: 3:17

yes, we've talked about him on the podcast before. Actually, uh, Jeremy, your co hoard over at Pride of Detroit, that's who he mentioned. And he had a different, you know, a lot of people just, uh, think down on Scott Mitchell, but Jeremy didn't think of him that way. Obviously he didn't bring anything of note to Detroit, but, you know, he, Had positive thoughts about Scott Mitchell. Most Alliance fans, you ask about Scott Mitchell and, uh, you know, the first thing you hear is a groan or something like that.

Morgan Cannon: 3:44

I mean, he's a fine quarterback. That's kind of how, you know, I look at it. He's. revolved around Barry and that was an era of football that we were in. But yeah, I, you know, Mitchell was fine, nothing, nothing too bad.

Jason Harwood: 3:58

So Jacob was a little too young for the Barry Sanders era and. You know, I can't ever tell him how it was to watch a game, you know, I have never found the words to explain how it was to watch a game that Barry played in, like live when you didn't know it was going to be a highlight play, you knew one was coming, you just didn't know when, and it was just like the anticipation of two yards here, three yards here, up, he just busted a 50 yarder or whatever he did, and I have never, I've never, I don't, have you, have you Is there any player that's gave you that same experience in the NFL that Barry did?

Morgan Cannon: 4:34

Don't know. I don't, not since like maybe like Dante Hall for that little period of time. Remember Dante Hall, the punt returner for the

Jason Harwood: 4:40

Oh, yeah.

Jacob: 4:41

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 4:42

was, was electric to watch, but like Barry man, just remember like one of my first, like, like seared in football memories was Thanksgiving, 1997. We were playing the bears. we beat them like 55 to 20. Barry had like four touchdowns, like ran for like, I think almost 200 yards off the top. I remember because we used to like, we would record games like over V like random VHS tapes. Y'all remember used to do that.

Jacob: 5:10

Yeah.

Jason Harwood: 5:11

yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 5:11

uh, so I, we would have that. And I, I probably watched that thing so many times, man, a little bored. I would just watch that like a movie, put it in. Watch it. And that's where like, probably my parents should have been like, this man's a little sick in the head here. Once he watched this football game over and over for, but yeah, no, Barry was the best man. I, a couple of years ago, uh, my ticket rep who like was like my friend from when I worked at the YMCA downtown, for the lions, he was like, Hey man, will you, uh, could you be ready for this? Like, uh, to get on a zoom call, this is like kind of COVID times, right? Like that, that year, the Thanksgiving game. we got killed by the Texans right the day before Patricia and Quinn got fired,

Jason Harwood: 5:52

Mm hmm.

Morgan Cannon: 5:53

uh, they got me on like a zoom call earlier in that week. And it was Barry, man. He like talked to like several different fans, like, you know, one on one. Uh, so that was just cool too. Like, I just, that's always going to be my goat. Like if y'all remember that, uh, magazine cover from like,

Jason Harwood: 6:08

Mm hmm.

Morgan Cannon: 6:09

it's up, it's up there framed, but one of my friends had that done for me. So yeah, definitely my goat, man. That's like my, That was my everything come, you know, as a little kid

Jason Harwood: 6:19

Yeah. My little brother just thought he was Barry Sanders on the football field. He was just, you know, trying to emulate every juke and every spin is, yeah, it growing up in the nineties and seeing him was. Just an unreal time. Uh, it's excitement every game, even though the team was, you know, every other year they would make the playoffs. Um, you know, they would make the playoffs, disappointment, make the playoffs and, you know, ultimately led to Barry wanting to leave, but, or beer done. it's hard to explain to anybody that wasn't. game at that time, like how exciting it was to watch just a normal run and just anticipate what was going to happen.

Morgan Cannon: 6:55

and he had like the perfect running back aesthetic, you know, like there was that time back in the day where he wore their like reflect, they don't allow it anymore because of concussions, but he wore the reflective visor and man, like some of the coldest, like sports, like photos back in the day were like, you know, him standing in the backfield, like, uh, you know, the quarterback and just you could see everything on his visor. I'm like, man, that's a

Jacob: 7:18

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 7:19

That's he's just awesome, man. Just an awesome running back fun to watch That's just my dude. I still have the berry like the mitchell and ness love that, you know, that's just that's just my goat man

Jacob: 7:31

Right.

Jason Harwood: 7:32

Yeah. No, already to go. That's just, he's the man. All right. Let's talk about this current iteration of the lions. Um, really simple, simple question. We're going to start with you, Morgan going into this by we're three and one. Are you happy with that? Are you satisfied with a three and one start to the season?

Morgan Cannon: 7:51

Yeah, I think so like if you'd asked me before this like, you know, obviously four no would have been nice But this is a pretty tough start, you know, like you ran it back with the rams and the bucks You both of those teams look like, well, the Rams, I think are a little derailed right now because of injuries. And they're just, I don't know about them, but the bucks are looking good. I think they're in like last I saw before I turned the TV off, they were in a shootout with Atlanta. I took the over for that one because they, I don't know if

Jacob: 8:16

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 8:17

plowed yet in that game. Um, so yeah, I'm happy about it. You know, you're looking at it three, one, you come out of the buy, you got Dallas and you've set yourself up for there's some winnable games here. Like every game in the NFL is tough. Like, don't get me wrong. Like there's a world where the lions could, you know, you could lose any, any given Sunday. If there's a reason that's a movie. Right. So I think it sets you up well, but there's still work to be done. What about y'all though? How do y'all feel about the three and one start?

Jason Harwood: 8:45

You can go Jacob.

Jacob: 8:47

I'm okay with three and one as well, especially when the first two, you know, where those playoff rematches, like you said, you have those two back to back. If you can, you know, be one and one out of that, that's cool, especially with how the games went. It wasn't like we were overmatched or whatever. I mean, we, you know, we were killing the game against the bucks. We did everything except getting the end zone. So, I mean, you know, like you said, obviously, 4 and 0 would have been better, but 3 and 1 is still a good number. I mean, especially, you know, like I said, we won. We've played 3 of the 4 NFC West teams already. We finally won against the Seahawks, you know, for the first time since 2012. Right. So, I mean, I'm okay. Vibes are still high.

Jason Harwood: 9:25

Yeah. I think, yeah, three and one is great. I mean, the only reason you can be disappointed is because we basically dominated the book, the box, that whole game and, and lost it just because we. You know, couldn't get in the end zone for various reasons or whatever, but the defense has looked good three out of the four games. Like I'm very happy with the defense. And I, I'm still thinking that the way they played Seattle was they, they took the ball, they wanted to get up by a score and they wanted to play defense a certain way, not let them get over the top, you know, not let DK just dominate and go over the top and worry about that. And I think. That was, you know, it's a lot of bendo break situation. And I, I really believe that's what they played. And that may be why the defense showed out the way it did. Also, um, Gino Smith just played an amazing game and that's. know, sometimes you could do it. All right. And you, you know, he's going to find an open man. So, uh, I'm happy with three and one, uh, of course, you know, four and it was great, especially, you know, like I said about the box, I think we, that was a definitely a winnable game, but you know, we exercise some demons with Seattle and, um, we've looked. You know, Derek off in the last two games is just playing, he's checking down and just giving what the defense, he, you know, has given him. And, you know, it's really weird. The bucks game, we, you know, the game we lost, we just didn't run it. And they felt like passing was the way to, to win that game. The way the other games have played out, it's, it's shown that, you know, running it, they could have probably ran them. Well, you know, One that game, you know, I'm, I'm going to trust Dan Campbell and, uh, and company. They've, they've done as well so far. So, all right.

Morgan Cannon: 11:12

earned that. You know what I mean? Like, I think when you look at the context too, like I feel even better about three and one, like y'all said, because. They didn't play their best game against the Rams or the Bucs. And like you talked about, they dominated the Bucs in the box score. They just put one for seven from the red zone. We've heard it all before. And then, yeah, the defensive performances have been good. And I think there's a lot of context you have to add around the Seahawks game just because they were on the field for 90 plays. I'm

Jacob: 11:38

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 11:39

through the film. Like that second half felt like a marathon. And I think that's when they started busting some of those Kenneth Walker runs was when the defense was just gassed because. were on the field a lot. Like even when the lines are scoring. the Jameson Williams, one yard, you know, one yard, one play drive,

Jacob: 11:56

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 11:57

they could have used some time off, you know, the defense could have used a little bit more of a breather there instead of they got a, you know, a quick strike and you're not going to complain about seven points, but you know what I mean? And so it's all, it all, all matters. That's kind of how I look at it. Right?

Jacob: 12:11

For sure.

Jason Harwood: 12:12

And the bi week is, you know, we were all arguing, you know, at the beginning of the year, we hate, we hate it when the schedule come out, we got the early bi week, but with the injuries of late, it's kinda, it may work out in our favor, um, of injuries, our next four games are going to be at Dallas at Minnesota versus the Titans and at Green Bay, Dallas is a team that's going to be fighting some major injuries. So we're probably catching them at a very good time. Um, you know, they're going to be without their pride, their two best defenders for that, for that game. So in a similar vein of, you know, we're three women with those games, what record are you going to be happy with? If we come out at, you know, Especially we got two division games on the road. So Morgan, we'll start with you, what record would you be happy with just looking at those four games?

Morgan Cannon: 12:59

So there's some tough games, right? Like the Titans have even, they've, you know, played some good football here and there minus, uh, Will Levis just going absolutely bonkers and doing, doing crazy things with the football. So I think I wouldn't be mad at two and two, you know, I wouldn't be mad there. You're still in a good position moving forward. Uh, I'd be happier with three and one. Again, you repeat that you're a six and two, and then you're, you're kind of, you know, in the driver's seat to determine what you were, where you're going to be with playoff seating. Right. And that's where, that's where I want this team to be like firmly in that seat. you know, the real, real football starts being played late November on, right. Like where it really, really, really. Every game counts, but it really begins to count. You guys know what I mean? So I think that's where I'd be. What about y'all?

Jason Harwood: 13:46

I'd be happy with three and one, just like you said is good. And then that means we're going to split one to probably split one of those division games. I think, you know, Titans at home, it's definitely a winnable game at Dallas. Like I said, I think we're catching them at the right, right time. Um, they're going to have, and we have to exercise, you know, a bad call from last year and there's, it's going to be a lot, you know, that's going to be said, uh, I think the lines are going to go in there and do that. Maybe we'll get in a little bit when we talk a little bit of the NFC North later on, but you know, you've got two road division games at the beginning of the season. We're thinking of the Packers are going to be our higher challenger and that may turn out to be, but Minnesota's 4 0 right now. So you really want to deal them a loss if you keep, you know, going three one every quarter, that's a recipe for playoffs and probably a division win. So yeah, three and one's good. What about you, Jacob?

Jacob: 14:38

Absolutely. Obviously, you want to win them all, right? I mean, 3 and 1, you're fine. 2 and 2, not ideal, but still okay. 1 and 3, you're kind of hitting the panic button there. Um, you know, especially how it's playing out the next game we have at Dallas. Like you already mentioned, they're going to be without some of their top defenders. Dallas has the, you know, the worst rushing offensive attack in the league. And we have a top 5 run defense. We're So they're going to be throwing the ball a whole lot. Hopefully we have the bi week we can game plan, you know, try to defend that pass a little more than, you know, how we did it against Seattle. Um, you know, but that, that should be a very winnable game as is the game against the Titans. The two really difficult ones, you know, are going to be at the Vikings and at the Packers, those divisional matchups, you know, the Vikings matchup looks a heck of a lot more interesting than it did before the season started. Sam Donald's playing very well right now. The Vikings run defense, I think is like top three, top two in the league or something like that, you know, so that's an interesting matchup to see our rushing attack against their run defense and you know, it's interesting because if you, you know, let's say after those first three games, if you go one and two, like how, how desperate do we need that Green Bay when at that point, you know, we can't, like I said, you don't want to go one and three. And especially if we're already doing that, you, you can't lose the Packers. So, I mean, obviously, ideally, 4 0 is where we want to be at. Especially if we can get through and win all four of these games and, you know, three of the four being away, that's huge for the season. And it's, you know, with the team that we have now, it's definitely obtainable. It's not, you know, It's not that we're asking too much. It's not too far out there to suggest that we're going to win these next four games against some tough opponents.

Morgan Cannon: 16:26

Yeah. And this is that stretch of the season where they're on the road a lot. Like when we first got the schedule, we're like, okay, this could be a little bit, you know, they're on the road. There's like, I think we have like one home game until like December. Right. Jason, like I think it's something.

Jason Harwood: 16:38

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 16:39

gonna be a while like I

Jason Harwood: 16:41

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 16:41

it's like a month.

Jason Harwood: 16:42

the, after this four game set there, they're at Houston the following week. So it's like four to the next five are on the road, which

Morgan Cannon: 16:49

That's what it was. yeah,

Jacob: 16:51

hmm.

Morgan Cannon: 16:54

Yeah, that's a tough one. Like, you know, it's a tough stretch Jets and Vikings 930 a. m Though in in London, so that'll

Jacob: 17:00

Yeah, right, right.

Morgan Cannon: 17:02

wake up and watch cuz oh that's a gross game. If you're a Lions fan because

Jacob: 17:08

Yeah, right. Do you root for Aaron Rodgers, or do you, uh, you know,

Morgan Cannon: 17:11

I know it's like, God, it

Jacob: 17:13

you can't ever root for Aaron Rodgers.

Morgan Cannon: 17:14

I know exactly how I feel, but then I don't want the Vikings to

Jacob: 17:18

Yeah, right, right,

Morgan Cannon: 17:19

So I think we might have

Jacob: 17:20

man.

Morgan Cannon: 17:20

the, we might have to get on that train for once.

Jacob: 17:23

Yeah, uh,

Morgan Cannon: 17:24

I'll root for sauce gardener, Detroit kid.

Jacob: 17:26

yeah, right. There you go. Pick six to win it.

Jason Harwood: 17:29

Good job. I. it's going to, I speaking of that nine 30 football, it is great to, wake up. I always think about what it'd be like on the West coast. You know, you're just like, you have to set your alarm to wake up for football on Sunday. It's just one o'clock is so long to wait because you wake up and you just want football to be here. I mean, I don't know what, how you guys feel, but I'm sure it's just like, I feel like wake up, you know, eight o'clock with the kids, you take the dog on a walk and you're like, man, I still got hours and know, I can't only watch, you know, the talking heads talk so much, you know, as I got to figure out something else to do during those four hours, but

Jacob: 18:07

have four kids.

Morgan Cannon: 18:08

They, I was going to say, Jacob, you, you don't have that time. I usually clean my house. That's like how I get my energy

Jacob: 18:13

Yeah, right.

Jason Harwood: 18:14

good

Jacob: 18:15

I gotta get everything ready so I can just do nothing but watch football for the rest of Sunday.

Morgan Cannon: 18:18

Exactly. That's exactly it. Subconsciously. That's what I'm doing.

Jacob: 18:22

Yeah.

Jason Harwood: 18:23

Yeah. Yeah. Not looking at your watch the whole time going. Okay. All right. All right.

Jacob: 18:27

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 18:28

pass? Yeah,

Jason Harwood: 18:30

right. So something that's, uh, that. After Monday is going to be a harder question. Jacob, we're gonna start with you, your favorite play so far of all, up to this by week of the season. What's your favorite play that's happened. It could be offensive defense, special teams, however you want to do it.

Jacob: 18:49

Yeah, you're right. There's been quite a few memorable plays already. Um, but I, I think the favorite, if I had to pick my favorite play, I'm gonna go with the Shake and Bake play. The, uh, you know, hook and ladder that we pulled off against the Cardinals. It just was kind of, you know, it was obviously it was really unexpected. Uh, you know, just a very cool play. Worked to perfection, scored a touchdown with Gibbs off of it. That was very cool. So it's hard, but that's what I'm going to say is my favorite place so far.

Jason Harwood: 19:15

that's a good choice. about you, Morgan?

Morgan Cannon: 19:18

an excellent one. There's so many that running around in my head. I'm going to go maybe recency bias, but. catch that Monty had where he planted, uh, Devin Witherspoon,

Jacob: 19:28

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 19:30

watching that live, you're like, hold on now. And then he kept on running and that man's running. Like it popped into my head this week when I was watching the film, it's got some like Marshawn Lynch to him, man. Like the way he's running the ball, like the jump cuts. the acceleration and then just being able to baptize you if you get in his way. So I love it. Yeah, that's probably my favorite this so far. I love some

Jacob: 19:54

Good call.

Jason Harwood: 19:55

Yep. That's you're right on it, Morgan. I'm, I'm going to say that is my favorite play. And I think it's awesome that we it's four games in season and we can, have so many different places to choose from. It's been, you know, that Jamo 70 or touchdown that, I mean, on any given other team, that's like, that's the play. Right. And like, might've been the third best play offensive play of that game, because you've got a golf Philly special coming out. I mean, that, how, cool is that? I mean, you know, you got a, I'm an out there on a dot. And so there's just in that game alone. And then Jacob, you're right. The hook and ladder play. It's

Morgan Cannon: 20:32

Butter.

Jason Harwood: 20:33

can that be even an afterthought? Like, cause that's like, you know, I go back to that hook and ladder play against green Bay. Cause that's where the first time we saw it, it was a little ran a little bit different than, than what we saw. Um, you know, in Arizona game, we've run it before and it worked really well, in green Bay, we got, that was like a third and like 20, and I think we got, well, we got like Fourth and three. And that's when he threw to a DJ chark and we ended up icing that game after that play. So yeah, there's so many cool plays, you know, and defensively, we haven't talked about any of Kirby's interceptions. Um, the last one especially was just an incredible catch

Jacob: 21:14

Right.

Jason Harwood: 21:15

You know, we talked about it on our recap, Jacob, that it was very, um, very Megatron ask. He high pointed it and then brought it in. I mean, that, that was just a great catch and

Morgan Cannon: 21:28

athlete.

Jason Harwood: 21:29

yeah,

Jacob: 21:30

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 21:30

athlete.

Jason Harwood: 21:31

know, and the way Kirby's playing so far this year. It's, it's, been very refreshing. He is,

Jacob: 21:39

Yes.

Jason Harwood: 21:40

um, I don't know if it's like he's just trusting the other guys around him to make a play, so he's setting himself up, uh, whereas maybe last year he's trying to, you know, anticipate too much and just fight, because he would find himself out of position and it might lead to some, big plays just over his head because he's out of position, um. We really, outside of Carlton Davis, I don't know. We haven't really let a lot of receivers get over the top on us this, this season. Um, DK Metcalf got by CD and got tackled at the one, um, in this last game. But I really, and I know Marvis and Harrison had one on CD in the end zone, but it really, they haven't burned us really deep this year. So, we've gotten cooked underneath a lot, you know, but that just might be how they're choosing to do it. So, right. Morgan, we'll start with you on this one. Offensive MVP so far this year, or so far up to this year, to the, by week.

Morgan Cannon: 22:41

Got to go David Montgomery.

Jacob: 22:43

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 22:44

So essential to the team's identity and the weight, like, obviously you could pick, like, I'm probably the biggest Panay Sewell fan there is. Like I was jumping for joy when the Lions drafted him. I thought like I followed, I'm not even one who follows recruiting that, but I know like, you know, I'm a little bit tapped in and I heard about this 17 year old starting in Oregon as a freshman. And I was like, oh my gosh, this kid's going to be, and he hasn't let us down. But yeah, I think I got to go. I think I got to go money. Just because of like the drive against the Rams, uh, the game against Seattle. He had the crazy game, you know, against Arizona, obviously. So I think mommy, how about y'all

Jacob: 23:25

Yeah. I went with the same. I picked David Montgomery as well. I mean, I, you just have to, like you said, you know, against the Rams, like we just took over in overtime. Just those tough runs. Uh, You know, that he's just been so consistent with, you already mentioned the catch the Seattle game. He's just, big plays. Every time you give him the ball, you just trust him. No turnovers, no like close calls or anything like that. You know, short yardage situations. He's just been on so far this year. So definitely gets my vote as well

Jason Harwood: 23:53

So I'm with all I'm with you guys, but when I started looking at the stats, just have a question for you guys. The overtime drive alone, just like cements them. And then he just plowing. Like we said, our offensive play of the years is demo. And then the carry play where, you know, the defense picks them up and the offensive line push. He's just been the figurehead, you know, and then he didn't show up that much in the Tampa Bay game and we lost that game. So it's just, he's definitely been our MVP. Right. But I just looked at Gibbs and I found some interesting stats maybe you've looked them up, I don't know, but who do you think is rushed for more yards?

Morgan Cannon: 24:31

Gibbs?

Jason Harwood: 24:32

Gibbs has

Morgan Cannon: 24:33

only know that girl. Yeah. Looking at stats today. It's

Jason Harwood: 24:37

Yeah. So

Jacob: 24:37

as close, right?

Jason Harwood: 24:38

It is, it's 285 to 271, based on my memory from the game, I'd almost say that, you know, Montgomery, cause we've, indicated that he's just more in our brain, but Gibbs has rushed for more yards. And I found this stat incredibly. interesting when you're running between the tackles. Which one do we think more of? We think a demo more than, than Gibbs, right? We know Gibbs can do it, but what do you think the yards per carry on in between the tackles, you know, between the two is you got any guests? I'm going to put

Jacob: 25:14

The difference between them,

Jason Harwood: 25:15

Yeah. Between demo and Gibbs.

Morgan Cannon: 25:18

probably substantial. Yeah. Or like three or four, because like Like where I see Gibbs, like I was watching the film and he's so patient and that the hole opens up or he sees a crease and he mashes are too, man. He's so fast. It's so incredible.

Jacob: 25:34

That one play, the hole was wide open though too, where he just like, green grass just, yeah right,

Morgan Cannon: 25:40

doesn't waste time though. I give him credit. He

Jacob: 25:42

yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 25:43

goes.

Jason Harwood: 25:45

averaged six in between. This is in between the tackles only 6. 5 yards per carry on 20 attempts. Gibbs is 4. 2 on 27 attempts. It's,

Jacob: 25:56

Montgomery is the second one that you said?

Jason Harwood: 25:58

is Gibbs lead them by two yards, but Gibbs gets some more gash plays and that's what happens.

Jacob: 26:03

Yeah.

Jason Harwood: 26:04

more consistent by Gibbs gets a big gash plays.

Jacob: 26:09

many more attempts did you say you had like seven or eight?

Jason Harwood: 26:12

So DEMO's got 27, GIPSA's got 20. So, you know, DEMO's getting, obviously, we get He's just getting more attempts in there. Um, he's just more reliable, he doesn't do a lot of dancing. He just gets in there and goes, you're right. Gibbs is patient and waits for that hole. There was a, I don't know, I think it was the Seattle game. I don't know the exact play. There was a, such a small hole. They showed a replay. It was a really good replay and we didn't know how Gibbs fit through the hole. And. His vision is just unreal.

Morgan Cannon: 26:42

I like that Ben Johnson overlaps a lot of their usage too, because it just makes defenses like there's not a tell when either or is on the field. You know what I mean?

Jacob: 26:51

Yes.

Morgan Cannon: 26:51

it's not like Gibbs is in. Okay. They're running stretch. They're going to try to get him to the edge or okay. Montgomery's and they're going to, you know, they're going to run power or duo, try to get him. You know, north and south. It's, there's a lot of overlap. And in my opinion, that's tough to deal with as a defensive coordinator, because you're like, Oh, there's not really any tells they can both do it all. Which is nice. It's a luxury.

Jason Harwood: 27:13

When some, when people describe him as thunder and lightning, I don't really, I don't mean, obviously Gibbs is faster. Gibbs can do what Montgomery does. He can go in between the tackles. And I know Morgan, you and I talked about a certain play and it's a very, it was third and one goal line. We were in, we were in the red zone against the Rams. And. Gibbs, this gets like two yards on the play, but he was trying to run outside and then just knifed up there. The defenders ran, you know, were, had to respect the speed that he was going to get out the outside. And that just gave him all the leverage, but you know, I'm thinking of like theoretic or someone like in our past, would it just try to go outside and end up not getting that? Whereas Gibbs was smart enough to know. I could stretch it and then just knife up. All I need to get is the yard. I don't need to get the touchdown. I need to get the yard so that, we can get, in the end zone. And that's exactly what happened. They got touched on on the, I think on the next player, the next couple of plays in that, you know, and that was in the Rams game. So I it's, it's. You know, thunder and lightning does not describe them very, very well. Uh, it just doesn't. And you're right. There's no tells. And that's a great point, Morgan. And that's why the offense can be so multiple because you don't know who. You know what they're going to do when they got either one of them in there.

Morgan Cannon: 28:31

No. And sometimes like make the, people try to make fast athletes running backs and you, you know, that can work for so long. Shoot. Sometimes they're even in the NFL. You're like, then are they really running backs? Like you never have that question with Gibbs. Like he's picked up. He's not the past protector that Montgomery is just because Montgomery stature is crazy, man. He's built like, you know,

Jacob: 28:53

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 28:53

good Lord, like a powerhouse. But yeah, even Gibbs has stepped up. He's become a better past protector. And yeah, I know exactly what play you're talking about. Jason just puts his foot in the ground, knows the down and distance knows he needs to move the chains. heady veteran play. And you can just tell like, well, obviously he played running back under Nick Saban. You better have your stuff together. You know what I mean?

Jacob: 29:15

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 29:16

mess around.

Jason Harwood: 29:17

Defensive MVP. This is, seems like a no brainer, but we're going to ask the question every way. Jacob, you get to start this time.

Jacob: 29:25

Well, I have my no brainer answer, but then I have another, uh, another person who deserves a vote here. So obviously the defensive MVP has to be Aiden Hutchinson. Uh, no doubt about that. You know, pro football focus ranked him number one overall in the league. League leading six and a half sacks. He had, you know, double digit quarterback pressures and a couple of games he's got, like, I think it was like 15 more pressures than the next highest guy in the league. He's just been dominating, just as, as expected, he's just every play he's bringing it. There's no quit. There's no giving up just really the leader on the defense for us. And. I think he just embodies what the Lions team is about, you know, showing grit and everything. You just, you can't say enough positive things about Hutchinson. And you know, you just, even you look at these replays and Where he doesn't have a pressure, maybe doesn't, have any, impact on the stat sheet, but then you look back and you see, he's still bringing it every single time. So, Hutchinson, obvious defensive MVP, um, but the other player that I think deserves a voter deserve mention is going to be Kirby. Joseph, um, you know, Morgan, you said earlier, you know, it's becoming more of a complete safety. He's really, obviously early on in the season, but he really has taken that next step. You know, if he's not back there, if he's been injured, he's doing the whole, you know, center field thing, ball hawk. And he's also coming down and, you know, he's making some big plays. He's making some big tackles. Uh, you know, some bigger hits, some third down stops, just a lot of clutch plays from Kirby Joseph so far this year, past breakups. I mean, he's really, you know, he's been doing it all. So I think he deserves a mention here as well.

Morgan Cannon: 31:05

I love it. You know, I'm a big Kirby fan man I think he's becoming like you talked about coming to complete safety making plays around the line of scrimmage being active and run fits He's you know, his superpower is always gonna be being a ball hawk, you know playing like that deep you know, single high or, you know, middle third, whatever, whatever he's in, whatever the defense is in, going to be his superpower, but he's had really good reps and man. So you love to see Kirby's growth and it really just speaks to this coaching staff because you consistently see people just elevate their game and speaking to elevating their game, man. Hutchinson was a really good player last year. I watched You know, I watch a lot of tape. Um, he's, he's in that category, like that tier of pass rushers underneath, like I would say, like the, the elite elite, right? Like the miles Garretts, the TJ Watts, uh, Nick Bosa, Parsons, et cetera. if he puts together a full season of what we're seeing now on tape, yeah, he's in that conversation and he's flirting with being max Crosby. Sorry. I was forgetting someone earlier. But yeah, like he's flirting with that. Cause it, when you turn it on, man, he is a game wrecker. He has that spin move, which is pretty much unblockable. Now he'll hit it to the outside. He'll hit it to the inside. Then he, like his hands are really active swimming, ripping, just swatting hands and dipping under. Like he's got pretty good bend too, for being a six, seven guy. then he sets you all up and these tackles are worried and he has the power. He's gotten a lot stronger since he like got here in 2022. Thicker in the legs, just a more powerful athlete. And he hit, he hits you with that bull rush. It happened a couple of times against Seattle, or he walked that tackle back into, uh, Gino's lap almost immediately. And it affects people, even like you said, Jacob, it's something that might not even show up or register as a hurry through pro football reference or PFF or wherever you're looking. But it still affects the play when you turn on the tape and you see how he's, you know, disrupting things

Jason Harwood: 33:04

Yeah. The only thing I'm going to add on the whole Aiden thing is I'm noticing. am him holding the edge better and quarterbacks are not escaping out, um, his way a lot. And that might be just better overall pressure from the defensive line in general. But, you know, I know Justin Fields would just give him fits every, you know, Aiden would do the inside spin move and Justin would see that and he'd run right to the outside. We've faced Kyler Murray, who's, you know, I mean, he, Fairly good athletes. So, and we kept them in check, uh, in, you know, Gino, the only time he escaped to the outside on is when Aiden did an inside inside spin move and Gino would escape to the outside. I feel like he, Aiden is holding that edge much better this year, just more responsibility, more responsible. And we're keeping these running quarterbacks in check. So I've, I have noticed that everything else, the pressures, the sacks, those are all, you know, high effort plays that, you know, we've come to, you know, Become accustomed with him. And, it's hard to have these superlatives, you know, just said over and over again, but it is true. Um, and I also, you know, your point about Kirby, Joseph, Jacob, where would VV without some of those interceptions that interception and the very first game, I mean, that game is totally different if, if he doesn't pick some off right before the half and they get a touchdown and the Rams get a touchdown. And then, you know, Seattle that iced the game when he got the interception and that game. So they've all been in the end zone. All his interceptions have been in the end zone. I mean, those are critical in itself. You're keeping the other team from scoring. So, you know, Kirby. You would think it'd be a blowout for Aiden, and it probably is, but Kirby has been very vital to this defense and, um, hope he continues to be, I mean, he wanted to lead the league in interceptions this year. He's on, he's on a pretty good start for that.

Jacob: 34:49

right,

Jason Harwood: 34:51

All right. So we talked pretty glowingly about our defense. Um, but we have had some issues with penalties, mostly in our defensive backfield. So Morgan, you watch a lot of tape you're watching, you know, you see a lot of the film. Are you happy with how our cornerbacks are playing? I know the stats are not. Uh, glowing, but are you happy about how the offensive plane or should they change their approach so that they don't, they don't get as many penalties?

Morgan Cannon: 35:19

No, I don't think it's something you can alter approach wise. Like Aaron Glenn, the Lions defensive coordinator wants to play a lot of man. So in doing so both Carlton. And Terry on or like have been really sticky and coverage like Terry on some of his past interference calls have been pretty ticky tacky. Others like, yeah, those are those are DPI. You know, that's fine. That's going to happen when you play as much man as the lion. So I'd rather, you know, DBS be sticky like that and coverage. then be completely out of phase and like give up a lot of big plays. You know what I mean? So I think it's going to get better like that. of those against DK Metcalf for Carlton were tough because Metcalf is such a physical receiver. Like the way he just, the way he plays at the top of his route, the way he blocks getting in and out of breaks, he's going to like put his hands on you. It's all subtle, but he's going to do it. So you have to be physical with him. So I'm not going to condemn it, you know, get on a Carlton for that either. Um, so I'm happy with it. I think it's going to continue to get better. Hopefully Carlton or Tarion gets, you know, better with time and just more reps at the pro level with getting his head around, making a play on the ball. Um, and they, they, people are going to keep picking, you know, throwing at him because he's a rookie and they're going to, they're going to try him. So we'll, we'll see. That's good. The sample size is going to keep growing, right?

Jason Harwood: 36:39

Yeah, I'm, I'm with you on that. Any quarterbacks they get in trouble. They're going to throw that direction, hoping that a flag comes out. Right. Um, the thing that I'm encouraged about Terry on is that he is sticky and he's right there. He's not, um, they're not, you know, able to, you know, burn them on a double move or anything like that. He's He's been right there with the receiver. So I'm happy with that. Um, I keep going back to him and Darius Slay cause Darius Slay has, was, our last great corner that we had and he didn't look great in his first year and he looked like we had made a mistake and then he finally put it together. Ideally we don't have a rookie corner out there, you know, doing all this, but he's. most talented one, he's learning on the job and, you know, we're hoping this pays dividends at the back end of the year that he's had all this coming up, but the problem is that once you get tagged with those flags with the refs, they're looking for it. And if they see any, a little bit, or the, know, the receiver plays, plays them up a little bit. They're more apt to throw the flag. So that's the only thing I don't like about it is that, you know, If it's going to be hard for him to work out of that, because they're going to have like a micro microscope on, his play, you know, as far as him, mentality and everything that he has, I'm not worried about him getting down on himself. So that, that's a positive right there.

Morgan Cannon: 38:00

He's not wanting to

Jacob: 38:00

right.

Morgan Cannon: 38:01

confidence.

Jacob: 38:03

No, the coverage is there. I mean, I, uh, I don't like the holding as much. I mean, I think that's just because he's a rookie. You know, he's getting used to the speed of the game and everything like that. The coverage is there. He doesn't need to hold. So that, you know, is something that can be cleaned up as far as the defensive, like the pass interferences. I feel like quite a few of them have really kind of been 50 50 about whether they would be called or not, but because he is a rookie and he really is maybe just a second late getting his head around a few times. Yeah. I'm not worried about it. I think it's something that's going to get cleaned up. And I think he's, you know, the movement is there. You know, the coverage is right there, so I think he's gonna be fine. Yeah. Yeah, right.

Jason Harwood: 38:45

on DJ or DK Metcalf, um, you know, Dan came on his press conference later on, said I wasn't worried about that play. You know, I, needed to play physical on DK. Cause if you don't play physical, he's just going to box you out and you're going to, know, he's going to catch the ball anyway. So I think that, um, Dan Campbell, you know, it. that he's going to call out his player, but he pretty much backed him up right there. And I think that's exactly how they want him playing. They're not going to play a DK Metcalf every week. You know, we've his body and body size and strength is very unique for a wide receiver. You play him differently than other receivers. So I'm not worried about that. I think it's going to get better. Hopefully, you know, we can like the Terrian holds, we can. That can be coached out. Um, just different way of playing it and just more confidence. Like I could stay with this guy. Cause he's right there. He just, he just needs to keep his hands, you know, to himself, a kindergartner, right? Keep your hands to yourself.

Morgan Cannon: 39:40

Yep.

Jason Harwood: 39:41

This next question I'm going to pose to you, Morgan, is because, um, at the end of the Seattle game, we get a safety. Okay. And I'm thinking back in my lions lore, this is like, this is how we blow a game, right? But I didn't have those thoughts. I didn't have S O L Lion's thoughts. for you as a Lions fan, being as fan, as long as we have, we've lived, uh, we've seen dramatic losses or whatever. Did you have those thoughts or when is the last time you had an SOL Lions thought?

Morgan Cannon: 40:11

I can't even remember to be honest with you, man, because it's, we've been doing this for a while now. Like late 2021, if you remember, they started putting some wins together, they were competitive, and then even early 2022, like they were right there, even though they started like, what, one and six. Um, there was like the game in Minnesota when Dan kicked the field goal and like, you know, was upset at the podium because he was like, yeah, that was like, they could have won some of those games. So really, I was like, okay, I felt like things were changing. So maybe like early 2021 to answer your question, like when I was just like, Holy crap, man, I've never really been at SOL. I don't know. Same old line, just cause don't know. Each team is different. Like the only thing that really stayed, you know, the same as all through all these years as a lions fan is the colors. Right. And like the city, other than that, like the, The principal owner changed, coaches changed a bunch, GM's changed a bunch. So I try not to think about that, but I feel like the scared, like, I know what you're talking about though, that dread, like when bad things happen, it's been probably early 2021, to be honest with you, because by the end of 2022, I was waking up and like, okay, we're probably going to win today. You know, I was, I was starting to expect it, but what a good feeling. Oh yeah,

Jason Harwood: 41:34

It's a totally different feeling. Cause even like at the end of that Seattle game, I did not get nervous. I just knew that we were going to win that. And I actually felt really confident than Arizona game. And then Rams game, just cause you go to overtime, of course you get nervous, but we get the ball and I felt, well, we got the ball, we won. Um, Previous, you know, my ultimate low was the Patricia years, just because I didn't like how anything was being handled. And, you know, you just are just very, I felt very negative. I mean, I'm still a huge lions fan, wanting them to win every week. Uh, but it was just hard to get behind that where it's very easy to root for these players and this coach and how everything's going on, you know, to me. Like the SOL, like stuff like when they beat Green Bay at the end of that season. Like I felt good going into that game, but it just felt like the tide had really turned at that point. I go back to what the Tigers are doing right now. Felt very similar to that except for the Tigers made the playoffs and we're getting to see that. We feel like if the Lions would have made the playoffs, they'd made a similar type wave in the playoffs that year, just because how they were playing at the time, the Tigers just happened to get in the right team's loss. And we played amazing. So the last time when I think that's when SOL went. It went to bed for me nationally. I don't think it's went away yet. I still think there's a lot of people that think we're going to fall flat on our face. A lot of people predict the Alliance to fall nationally, but locally, I think a lot of us are past that SOL. I mean, there's going to be some hangar ons that always talk bad about it. And some Lions fans that always want to seem, seem to want them to lose for. For some reason, I don't know what that is, but for you, Jacob, where, what, um, where are you at with that? Cause I know you're guy.

Jacob: 43:20

I'm very, extremely, but I've never, I've never been into the same old lions thing. I've never, you know, blamed it on that or whatever. You know, I feel like the people that go to that every single time, even now, there's people, I still see that on Twitter and everything like that. I feel like those are people that are either just not real fans or just people that don't watch all the time that are just, because it's been like that our whole lives or whatever, that's what they're used to. I mean, you know, I guess we just had a string of bad luck before, we talked about this before, but like, uh, you know, the NFL rules that are really irrelevant until they come up in a lion's game, just the different things that have happened to us with the different plays. I mean, that's all just bad luck. It's just added onto the history. But I mean, honestly, even in the Tampa Bay game, I still like, I really felt like any, any minute now we're going to break one of these through, like it's going to be fine and we're going to be okay until it wasn't. And. You know, the last couple of years have been like that. We know we have the right people in charge. We have the right team in place and we're going to play competitive football. Even if we don't come out with a win at the end of the day, we know we're going to play competitive football and it's not going to be oh and 16 where we're getting our butts handed to us. And we just, you know, don't even want to look at the train wreck that's about to happen. I mean, you know, that's over with. I hate the whole S. O. L. Same old lions thing. I hate seeing that. Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 44:43

I do too. I, you typically mute people. If I see it, I'm like, well, yeah, I

Jacob: 44:46

Yeah,

Morgan Cannon: 44:47

anything from you anymore. I You know, even during the Patricia years, right? Like I think of that Thanksgiving day game against Houston, that was embarrassing, but then you see Sheila with her hands in her face and I'm like, Oh my God, like, cause I, I've never thought like some of these fans back in the day, they're like, Oh, the Ford's didn't care. No, the Ford's cared, man. They just didn't hire the right people. It's pretty simple. A lot of these organizations do it, right? Like you look around, that's really what happens. You just end up not hiring the right people. Several times over and you'd waste a bunch of time and you end up not winning anything, but she, you know, the next morning she was like, yeah, we're done with this. We're not even gonna let them finish the year. I was like, okay, this is a, cause she had been doing smaller things before then to, to try to do things like, you know, change things up, do things differently. not that Martha was a bad owner and, you know, even old man Ford before that was just too loyal to Matt Millen. Like I'm not gonna, you know, that's, it wasn't good, but it's, it wasn't for lack of, it wasn't for lack of trying, you know? Uh, but yeah, I, I look at it now and she went through that whole process. I love the process they went through to get Brad Holmes. And then Dan Campbell

Jason Harwood: 45:57

Know who, well, Chris Spielman came first and that's the one that, you know, slammed it.

Morgan Cannon: 46:03

Great point. They like bring in, like, hey, you know, let's open the checkbook. Because he had a good job working for Fox Sports. He was like on one of the broadcast teams. And I always liked it when he called one of our games. I was like, yeah, here we go.

Jason Harwood: 46:14

Yeah. We're going to have someone that's not super biased that like, or I felt at the time or give us, I won't say bias, but someone that would give the lines respect, you know, like everyone else's is like, I'm the fourth team. Yeah. I'm the fourth team and I got stuck with the Lions game this week, is how I felt. And Chris FEMA would always, you know, talk really good about us and you could tell that he was rooting for us without over, over overtly rooting for us.

Morgan Cannon: 46:39

was funny this week to see Seahawks fans being like, Oh my God. Well, first of all, you guys are crazy. We had like the lines had like 12 penalties for like 100 something yards. But they're like, Oh, the, NFL wanted the Lions to win that game. How

Jacob: 46:52

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 46:53

how far have we come, man?

Jason Harwood: 46:54

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 46:55

you guys must not, you guys must not have been football fans very long because there is a time not long ago where other fan bases, I remember vividly on Twitter, like being like, dang, I'm sorry, y'all like whether it was the, the batted ball out of the back of the end zone Seattle game,

Jacob: 47:11

Yeah.

Morgan Cannon: 47:12

um, you know, there's so many, we don't need to bring them up, but you know what I

Jacob: 47:15

No, bad memories.

Morgan Cannon: 47:17

Yeah, like it was just funny to hear people think that like the NFL favors their golden child the Lions so much that they're

Jacob: 47:25

Yeah, you're putting us with the chiefs like we're getting all the calls.

Morgan Cannon: 47:28

That's hilarious to me

Jason Harwood: 47:30

As we've deal with this level of success that the lions haven't dealt with ever, like in our lifetime, this extended level of success, you just realize that those calls, the reason why they were, some of those calls were like, that was because we just didn't have the talent to overcome. That situation. So like,

Morgan Cannon: 47:48

insurmountable

Jason Harwood: 47:49

not saying that we didn't get the raw end of calls and me screaming at the TV didn't happen. Cause that happened all the time and thought, you know, everything's biased, but, you know, I could see Seattle going cause the pass interference at Tyler Lockett, that happens like almost on every.

Morgan Cannon: 48:05

Mm hmm.

Jason Harwood: 48:05

Every screenplay and they just happen to call it and that really turned the, you know, then they didn't get the fourth down and we got the ball, you know, and they didn't score on that. So that was a huge turning point. So I could see that, but I could also look at all the holding and, pass interference on Carlton Davis I don't know if you ever follow Tom Grossi, um, on YouTube, but he, yeah, so like he has this bit, he had started this bit last year where he had refs drop, Dressed up, you know, he's acting like he's a ref and the Packers are like, you're with us. And he's like, no, I'm with them now. And he's like pointing to the lion. So like, you know, he, it's just plays on the whole Aaron Rodgers thing, you know, and just the Packers they were the golden child and of

Jacob: 48:45

Yeah,

Jason Harwood: 48:46

North. And now, you know, the lions are yeah. Hilarious guy. And it was, it's a funny bit and it's, don't know how he is so in tune with every fan base to know, like, You know, to like get into the, it's hard to do that. I mean, we know the lions fan base and like the inside jokes, but for him to know the inside jokes for all these different fan bases that play on it. It's pretty amazing.

Morgan Cannon: 49:08

have some inside sources man, because yeah, I agree like he does know I'm like, oh How do you know about like he must be on? You I don't even know if I used to be on lines, read it a lot back in the day, but I guess it's probably just Twitter now. So maybe he's just on lines, Twitter stalking.

Jason Harwood: 49:22

it might be. So, all right, before we head out of here, let's just talk about the NFC North for a second. You know, going into it, we thought the Packers were probably going to be our main competition. So my first question to you, Morgan, is are the Vikings for real? They're 4 0, are they for real?

Morgan Cannon: 49:40

I don't, I don't know. I need a little bit bigger of a sample size. Like I think they've, they've beaten some tough teams, but they, the way they play, like the Brian Flores defense, they, they like to heat you up. They want to get you to those obvious passing downs and then throw the kitchen sink at you. So they're generating pressures. They're generating sacks. I want to see Sam Darnold do this for a little bit bigger of a sample size. Just because, you know, I'm not saying it's impossible. I'm just saying statistical data has shown us that it's unlikely, um, that a quarterback makes the turnaround like, you know, that he's thinking about making here. So obviously they have playmakers. They have, you know, Justin Jefferson, they have good players, but to see a little bit more. Uh, so I think the jury's out. If they, let's see that Jets Vikings game, that's going to be a

Jacob: 50:26

exactly.

Morgan Cannon: 50:27

I

Jacob: 50:27

Yes.

Morgan Cannon: 50:28

that because the Jets, their offense stunk it up the other night, but that defense is still legit. So if Sam Darnold wants to prove something, show us that you can throw the ball around against that Jets defense. Cause man, it's good.

Jason Harwood: 50:44

What about you, Jacob? What's your take on the Vikings?

Jacob: 50:47

Oh, I feel the exact same way. I kind of, you know, before the season started, I kind of called the darn old thing. I thought he was going to do really well. Uh, you know, just because of Kevin O'Connell and the way the team, you know, that's just the way they want their offense to work. And Sam Darnold's not a bad quarterback. He just has been a lot of bad situations. Like you said, he's got Justin Jefferson to throw the ball to. He's got, you know, he's got a decent offense. You know, the defense is showing out so far as well. So, I mean, we both, I think me and Jason both picked the Vikings to finish last in the division, uh, even behind the Bears. So that, you know, I feel like that may be different now just from what we've seen, but. Yeah, the Jets game is gonna be huge, because if Donald plays like he has against the Jets, then they're gonna be fine for the rest of this season. And, uh, you know, that'll just be another tough test later on. Um, as far as the Packers go, if we're going to go into, uh, you know, with them because they, obviously they just lost the game of the Vikings. Jordan Love started two games this year and those are the two games that they lost. So, I mean, right now it's so early on, but do you think Jordan Love is worth the contract that he got?

Jason Harwood: 52:01

I know you, well, you put out the smart Twitter on a Sunday. It was like, who's the 55 million quarterback in this game when Darnold or

Jacob: 52:09

Well, right. Arnold was lighting it up.

Jason Harwood: 52:11

you had first half, especially 28, nothing. The thing that did we see the real, like Vikings offense in the second half, because the Packers came storming back and Darnold fumbled and, you know, then there was, you know, You know, miss playing a punt and stuff like that. So it really looks scary, you know, them being three and O and then being up 28, nothing in green Bay against the Packers with Jordan love, you know, you were thinking they're going to win. I don't know. I, I still think the Packers defense is going to be tough. I still think they're going to be there at the end. The Lions seem to handle the Brian Flores defense pretty good last year. So I think for our head to head matchups, I think the lines are going to be fine there on the defensive front. Um, but any team that's got, uh, Justin Jefferson is going to be, you know, they could win any given week in the NFL because, throw it up and he'll, JJ is going to come down with it. So they, they have a fighting chance, but. I can't have too much belief in Sam Darnold, although, Sam Darnold, uh, could have just a Baker Mayfield season in him where, he did enough to get that next contract. Um, just if he's not in the right situation, I don't know if I would be wanting to pay him, Big money next year.

Morgan Cannon: 53:24

Yeah, that opens up an interesting conversation. And I, the Minnesota thing, like just from a Lions matchup standpoint, I feel good about that, at least on paper, just because the Lions run the ball so well. And if you can stay out of those third and long against like Brian Flores, those like third and long situations, I I think you mitigate a lot of the risk that he presents with everything that he throws at you. And golf's a veteran, you know, that helps too.

Jacob: 53:48

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 53:49

So, yeah. And then the Bears, don't know. We're still, you know, we're going to need a way bigger sample size to see what Kayla Williams is really like. The only thing that's tough is their offensive line has been playing some pretty bad football. I feel like that makes it really tough to evaluate these rookie quarterbacks, man, because as y'all know, it's hard to, it's hard for a veteran to stand back there and get, you know, beat and teed off on over and over again, let alone a rookie

Jason Harwood: 54:16

And that's what makes it puzzling. Why they drafted Roma Dunzi because like they could have, they could have got another solid offensive lineman. And I mean, I did, they trade for Keenan Allen after the draft or before the draft, I can't remember the timing on it, but they had DJ more and they're going to get Keenan Allen that extra weapon just seemed, you know, for, you know, they were running the ball pretty good last year it just seems like they get another get protect the quarterback, your rookie quarterback, but that seems like a bears type move to me. What the lions used to do by all the skill, get all the skill players and, um, wonder, the trenches are messed up. I mean, that's, you know, what was happening to Stafford is just getting constantly sacked and, know, you can have, you can have all the toys on the outside, but if you don't have enough time, it's, it doesn't really matter.

Morgan Cannon: 55:03

Yep.

Jacob: 55:04

For sure.

Jason Harwood: 55:05

I wasn't super. Excited about Caleb Williams. I just, he just rubs me the wrong way. Um, and so it doesn't surprise me what's going on with the bears and I'm, I'm okay, frankly, with them losing. hate the

Jacob: 55:20

Right.

Morgan Cannon: 55:20

hear you.

Jason Harwood: 55:22

Yep. So, all right, Morgan, thank you for coming on, spending your time with us. Sorry you had to break up your film session,

Morgan Cannon: 55:30

no

Jason Harwood: 55:31

Thanks again, Morgan, for coming out. And, Go lions!